Bicycle Board Members,
Damien will be meeting with Chief Preston Friday to discuss enforcement. I will meet with Damien tomorrow to discuss the attached talking points that I am recommending. I would appreciate your comments and recommendations for improving these talking points.
Frank D. Gmeindl Chairman, Morgantown Municipal Bicycle Board LCI #1703 491 WilsonAvenue Morgantown, WV 26501 304-376-0446 Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles
Looks like a good list to me. I assume there will also be encouragement to cite motorists for violations that endanger cyclists. I'd encourage Damien to describe "track stands" to Chief Preston. Many cyclists can use that technique to lawfully stop at stop signs etc. I once received a ticket for "running" a stop sign- in fact I had ceased all forward motion and looked bothways (Wilson & Grand, a dangerous intersection) but the officer told the judge I never put my foot down and that was that! (The judge liked it even less when I grumbled that motorists don't have to turn their engines off at stop signs............). I'm glad to see restraint suggested for riding on side walks. Some places that's our safest option. On my commute to Health Sciences I ride up the side- walk along the main entrance by the Alumni Center rather than risk the high speed traffic in the dual lane approach.
That's my 2 cents! Butch
-------------------------------------------
Stephen G. Graber
Biochem & Mol Pharmacology
PO Box 9142, HSN-3122
West Virginia University
Morgantown, WV 26506-9142
phone: 304-293-2305
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________________________________ From: bikeboard-bounces@cheat.org [bikeboard-bounces@cheat.org] On Behalf Of Frank Gmeindl [frank.gmeindl@comcast.net] Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 12:05 PM To: bikeboard Board Subject: [Bikeboard] Police Chief Talking Points
Bicycle Board Members,
Damien will be meeting with Chief Preston Friday to discuss enforcement. I will meet with Damien tomorrow to discuss the attached talking points that I am recommending. I would appreciate your comments and recommendations for improving these talking points.
Frank D. Gmeindl Chairman, Morgantown Municipal Bicycle Board LCI #1703 491 WilsonAvenue Morgantown, WV 26501 304-376-0446 Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles
Good list. I too ride on the occasional sidewalk, but not really downtown, more in short instances like what you're talking about Butch. But perhaps we're not going to be able to have that cake and eat it too... time will tell.
I'll have to disagree w/ you on "track stands", though I will recant a little at the end... Track stands are not good for the following reasons- * Track stands are ambiguous. "What's he doing? Where's he going? Is he going to fall? Is he trying to impress someone?" * Putting a foot down sends a clear signal to other motorists. I have stopped. I am abiding, Dude. * Although it looks like being in a track stand would make you quicker out of the gate, a lot of times this is not true. Depending on where you are in your "balance sway", which way your wheel is pointed at that moment, which way you're looking at that moment, etc. At a full stop I can react quicker and more predictably w/ one foot on the ground and pedal and body in the ready position. I can also signal w/ my hands to others if need be, most folks won't try that whilst in the track stand.
Since taking the TS101 course, then thinking about the way I ride, I have pretty much stopped doing the track stand, and bark at others when they do as well, especially when they come out of the stand and they're all over the place. Try the real stop in a few places that you normally track stand (in a turning lane, turning at a intersection) and I think you'll find that most others (cars and peds) treat you differently. More positively I would say.
I will say that I do go through intersection in a "momentary stop then roll-through", but technically I don't call this a track stand.
On Mon, Oct 10, 2011 at 12:32 PM, Graber, Stephen sggraber@hsc.wvu.edu wrote:
Looks like a good list to me. I assume there will also be encouragement to cite motorists for violations that endanger cyclists. I'd encourage Damien to describe "track stands" to Chief Preston. Many cyclists can use that technique to lawfully stop at stop signs etc. I once received a ticket for "running" a stop sign- in fact I had ceased all forward motion and looked bothways (Wilson & Grand, a dangerous intersection) but the officer told the judge I never put my foot down and that was that! (The judge liked it even less when I grumbled that motorists don't have to turn their engines off at stop signs............). I'm glad to see restraint suggested for riding on side walks. Some places that's our safest option. On my commute to Health Sciences I ride up the side- walk along the main entrance by the Alumni Center rather than risk the high speed traffic in the dual lane approach.
That's my 2 cents! Butch
Stephen G. Graber
Biochem & Mol Pharmacology
PO Box 9142, HSN-3122
West Virginia University
Morgantown, WV 26506-9142
phone: 304-293-2305
------ _0
------ _ <,_
---- (*)/ (*)
From: bikeboard-bounces@cheat.org [bikeboard-bounces@cheat.org] On Behalf Of Frank Gmeindl [frank.gmeindl@comcast.net] Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 12:05 PM To: bikeboard Board Subject: [Bikeboard] Police Chief Talking Points
Bicycle Board Members, Damien will be meeting with Chief Preston Friday to discuss enforcement. I will meet with Damien tomorrow to discuss the attached talking points that I am recommending. I would appreciate your comments and recommendations for improving these talking points.
Frank D. Gmeindl Chairman, Morgantown Municipal Bicycle Board LCI #1703 491 WilsonAvenue Morgantown, WV 26501 304-376-0446 Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles _______________________________________________ Bikeboard mailing list Bikeboard@cheat.org http://cheat.org/mailman/listinfo/bikeboard
I too ride on the occasional sidewalk, always did, it is good to see this acknowledged by serious riders.
Never on crowded downtown sidewalks. Elsewhere, dismount when pedestrians are present, those are the kinds of restrictions I would endorse.
I like to see that this issue is not emphasized in the police talking points.
Best, John
On Oct 10, 2011, at 2:23 PM, Gunnar Shogren wrote:
Good list. I too ride on the occasional sidewalk, but not really downtown, more in short instances like what you're talking about Butch. But perhaps we're not going to be able to have that cake and eat it too... time will tell.
I'll have to disagree w/ you on "track stands", though I will recant a little at the end... Track stands are not good for the following reasons-
- Track stands are ambiguous. "What's he doing? Where's he going?
Is he going to fall? Is he trying to impress someone?"
- Putting a foot down sends a clear signal to other motorists. I
have stopped. I am abiding, Dude.
- Although it looks like being in a track stand would make you
quicker out of the gate, a lot of times this is not true. Depending on where you are in your "balance sway", which way your wheel is pointed at that moment, which way you're looking at that moment, etc. At a full stop I can react quicker and more predictably w/ one foot on the ground and pedal and body in the ready position. I can also signal w/ my hands to others if need be, most folks won't try that whilst in the track stand.
Since taking the TS101 course, then thinking about the way I ride, I have pretty much stopped doing the track stand, and bark at others when they do as well, especially when they come out of the stand and they're all over the place. Try the real stop in a few places that you normally track stand (in a turning lane, turning at a intersection) and I think you'll find that most others (cars and peds) treat you differently. More positively I would say.
I will say that I do go through intersection in a "momentary stop then roll-through", but technically I don't call this a track stand.
On Mon, Oct 10, 2011 at 12:32 PM, Graber, Stephen sggraber@hsc.wvu.edu wrote:
Looks like a good list to me. I assume there will also be encouragement to cite motorists for violations that endanger cyclists. I'd encourage Damien to describe "track stands" to Chief Preston. Many cyclists can use that technique to lawfully stop at stop signs etc. I once received a ticket for "running" a stop sign- in fact I had ceased all forward motion and looked bothways (Wilson & Grand, a dangerous intersection) but the officer told the judge I never put my foot down and that was that! (The judge liked it even less when I grumbled that motorists don't have to turn their engines off at stop signs............). I'm glad to see restraint suggested for riding on side walks. Some places that's our safest option. On my commute to Health Sciences I ride up the side- walk along the main entrance by the Alumni Center rather than risk the high speed traffic in the dual lane approach.
That's my 2 cents! Butch
Stephen G. Graber
Biochem & Mol Pharmacology
PO Box 9142, HSN-3122
West Virginia University
Morgantown, WV 26506-9142
phone: 304-293-2305
------ _0
------ _ <,_
---- (*)/ (*)
From: bikeboard-bounces@cheat.org [bikeboard-bounces@cheat.org] On Behalf Of Frank Gmeindl [frank.gmeindl@comcast.net] Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 12:05 PM To: bikeboard Board Subject: [Bikeboard] Police Chief Talking Points
Bicycle Board Members, Damien will be meeting with Chief Preston Friday to discuss enforcement. I will meet with Damien tomorrow to discuss the attached talking points that I am recommending. I would appreciate your comments and recommendations for improving these talking points.
Frank D. Gmeindl Chairman, Morgantown Municipal Bicycle Board LCI #1703 491 WilsonAvenue Morgantown, WV 26501 304-376-0446 Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles _______________________________________________ Bikeboard mailing list Bikeboard@cheat.org http://cheat.org/mailman/listinfo/bikeboard
Bikeboard mailing list Bikeboard@cheat.org http://cheat.org/mailman/listinfo/bikeboard
Looks good, I agree with Gunnar about the track stands and there are signs downtown that state no riding on the sidewalks so there's that. Alice
On Mon, Oct 10, 2011 at 12:05 PM, Frank Gmeindl frank.gmeindl@comcast.netwrote:
Bicycle Board Members,
Damien will be meeting with Chief Preston Friday to discuss enforcement. I will meet with Damien tomorrow to discuss the attached talking points that I am recommending. I would appreciate your comments and recommendations for improving these talking points.
Frank D. Gmeindl Chairman, Morgantown Municipal Bicycle Board LCI #1703 491 WilsonAvenue Morgantown, WV 26501 304-376-0446 *Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles* **
Bikeboard mailing list Bikeboard@cheat.org http://cheat.org/mailman/listinfo/bikeboard
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Alice Vernon -
Frank Gmeindl -
Graber, Stephen -
Gunnar Shogren -
John Lozier