FYI. Bill Robinson is the state bicycle coordinator.
Frank /Same Roads Same Rights Same Rules / -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: capital] Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 13:54:17 -0500 From: Frank Gmeindl fgmeindl@verizon.net To: Robinson, Bill C Bill.C.Robinson@wv.gov CC: Kimberly Jo kimberlyjoshi@gmail.com, Don Spencer dspencer36@comcast.net, Jennie Selin JSelin@hotmail.com, cglagola@mail.wvnet.edu References: 494466FF.7000407@gmail.com C2EB27303808814DAA5C9E6917A821E7032B63FC@WVOTMAIL01.executive.stateofwv.gov
Bill,
Check the code. It says as far to the right as *practicable*, not possible.
The Uniform Vehicle Code Section 11-1205 Position on a roadway, provides some clarification: (a) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway except under any of the following situations:
1. When overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle proceeding in the same direction. 2. When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway. 3. When reasonably necessary to avoid conditions including but not limited to: fixed or moving objects; parked or moving vehicles; bicycle; pedestrians; animals; surface hazards; or sub-standard width lanes that make it unsafe to continue along the right-had curb or edge. For purposes of this section, a "sub-standard width lane" is a lane that is too narrow for a bicycle and a motor vehicle to travel safely side by side within the lane.
When the WV code says ride as near to the right side of the roadway as practicable, it means to ride as near as can reasonably accomplished under the circumstances to the right.
Approximately 40 other state's codes have similar "far to the right" clauses. I doubt the FHWA would publish a MUTCD that violates those state's laws. The new MUTCD recognizes that cyclists and motorists might need some help understanding the intent of the code. Section 9C.07 Shared Lane Marking states, "The Shared Lane Marking shown in Figure 9C-9 may be used to: A. Assist bicyclists with lateral positioning in a shared lane with on-street parallel parking in order to reduce the chance of a bicyclist's impacting the open door of a parked vehicle, B. Assist bicyclists with lateral positioning in lanes that are too narrow for a motor vehicle and a bicycle to travel side by side within the same traffic lane, C. Alert road users of the lateral location bicyclists are likely to occupy within the traveled way, D. Encourage safe passing of bicyclists by motorists, and E. Reduce the incidence of wrong-way bicycling."
We need that in Morgantown.
Concerning the Bicycles May Use Full Lane signs, Section 9B.06 Bicycles May Use Full Lane Sign (R4-11) states, "The Bicycles May Use Full Lane (R4-11) sign may be used on roadways where no bicycle lanes or adjacent shoulders usable by bicyclists are present and where travel lanes are too narrow for bicyclists and motor vehicles to operate side by side. The Bicycles May Use Full Lane sign may be used in locations where it is important to inform road users that bicyclists might occupy the travel lane."
I understand that Don Spencer, Deputy Mayor has been trying to set up a meeting with Ray Lewis. I hope that the meeting will be arranged so we will have the opportunity to reach a meeting of the minds.
Frank Gmeindl Chairman, Morgantown Municipal Bicycle Board
Robinson, Bill C wrote:
Kim -
I talked this morning to Cindy Cramer, who is the Acting Director for Traffic Engineering Division. She said that the people from Morgantown needed to talk to Ray Lewis (558-9451) or Travis Miller (558-9455) about the signage issue.
I had a copy of the October 30, 2008 letter, I just didn't realize it was the one that everyone was talking about. The bottom line is that state code says that bikes have to ride as far to the right as possible. The signage/markings being discussed either explicitly, or implicitly, encouraged bicyclist to utilize the entire lane. While the City could decide to do whatever they want on the City maintained streets, the City is justifiably concerned about liability about posting signs and markings that seem to contradict State code.
If the City has issues with WVDOH's position, then they need to schedule a meeting with either of the two Traffic Engineering personnel above.
If I were the City, I would explore marking the routes with markings/signage presently being utilized that emphasized that the bicyclists must keep to the right, but that is their call. I recommended the signage/markings to the Rahall Transportation Institute (RTI) for a project they were doing in Huntington. After discovering the conflict with State Code, they are considering using conventional signage markings and moving them to the right. In fact, my contact at RTI had recently viewed a similar signage/marking system in Louisville, Ky.
While this may be a temporary setback, both the City and DOH had concerns, it isn't that the WVDOH acted unilaterally or is discouraging the overall idea of the bicycle routes.
Bill Robinson WVDOH
It would be interesting to see/hear what the folks in Huntington are doing after they "found out" about "their" misinterpretation of the "law".
Since he talks of the fact that-
After discovering the conflict with State Code, they are considering using conventional signage markings and moving them to the right. In fact, my contact at RTI had recently viewed a similar signage/marking system in Louisville, Ky.
I guess this is where a state wide coordinator would be helpful. Man what a mess.
On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 1:57 PM, Frank Gmeindl fgmeindl@verizon.net wrote:
FYI. Bill Robinson is the state bicycle coordinator.
Frank Same Roads Same Rights Same Rules
-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: capital] Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 13:54:17 -0500 From: Frank Gmeindl fgmeindl@verizon.net To: Robinson, Bill C Bill.C.Robinson@wv.gov CC: Kimberly Jo kimberlyjoshi@gmail.com, Don Spencer dspencer36@comcast.net, Jennie Selin JSelin@hotmail.com, cglagola@mail.wvnet.edu References: 494466FF.7000407@gmail.com C2EB27303808814DAA5C9E6917A821E7032B63FC@WVOTMAIL01.executive.stateofwv.gov
Bill,
Check the code. It says as far to the right as practicable, not possible.
The Uniform Vehicle Code Section 11-1205 Position on a roadway, provides some clarification: (a) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway except under any of the following situations:
When overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle proceeding in the same direction. When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway. When reasonably necessary to avoid conditions including but not limited to: fixed or moving objects; parked or moving vehicles; bicycle; pedestrians; animals; surface hazards; or sub-standard width lanes that make it unsafe to continue along the right-had curb or edge. For purposes of this section, a "sub-standard width lane" is a lane that is too narrow for a bicycle and a motor vehicle to travel safely side by side within the lane.
When the WV code says ride as near to the right side of the roadway as practicable, it means to ride as near as can reasonably accomplished under the circumstances to the right.
Approximately 40 other state's codes have similar "far to the right" clauses. I doubt the FHWA would publish a MUTCD that violates those state's laws. The new MUTCD recognizes that cyclists and motorists might need some help understanding the intent of the code. Section 9C.07 Shared Lane Marking states, "The Shared Lane Marking shown in Figure 9C-9 may be used to: A. Assist bicyclists with lateral positioning in a shared lane with on-street parallel parking in order to reduce the chance of a bicyclist's impacting the open door of a parked vehicle, B. Assist bicyclists with lateral positioning in lanes that are too narrow for a motor vehicle and a bicycle to travel side by side within the same traffic lane, C. Alert road users of the lateral location bicyclists are likely to occupy within the traveled way, D. Encourage safe passing of bicyclists by motorists, and E. Reduce the incidence of wrong-way bicycling."
We need that in Morgantown.
Concerning the Bicycles May Use Full Lane signs, Section 9B.06 Bicycles May Use Full Lane Sign (R4-11) states, "The Bicycles May Use Full Lane (R4-11) sign may be used on roadways where no bicycle lanes or adjacent shoulders usable by bicyclists are present and where travel lanes are too narrow for bicyclists and motor vehicles to operate side by side. The Bicycles May Use Full Lane sign may be used in locations where it is important to inform road users that bicyclists might occupy the travel lane."
I understand that Don Spencer, Deputy Mayor has been trying to set up a meeting with Ray Lewis. I hope that the meeting will be arranged so we will have the opportunity to reach a meeting of the minds.
Frank Gmeindl Chairman, Morgantown Municipal Bicycle Board
Robinson, Bill C wrote:
Kim -
I talked this morning to Cindy Cramer, who is the Acting Director for Traffic Engineering Division. She said that the people from Morgantown needed to talk to Ray Lewis (558-9451) or Travis Miller (558-9455) about the signage issue.
I had a copy of the October 30, 2008 letter, I just didn't realize it was the one that everyone was talking about. The bottom line is that state code says that bikes have to ride as far to the right as possible. The signage/markings being discussed either explicitly, or implicitly, encouraged bicyclist to utilize the entire lane. While the City could decide to do whatever they want on the City maintained streets, the City is justifiably concerned about liability about posting signs and markings that seem to contradict State code.
If the City has issues with WVDOH's position, then they need to schedule a meeting with either of the two Traffic Engineering personnel above.
If I were the City, I would explore marking the routes with markings/signage presently being utilized that emphasized that the bicyclists must keep to the right, but that is their call. I recommended the signage/markings to the Rahall Transportation Institute (RTI) for a project they were doing in Huntington. After discovering the conflict with State Code, they are considering using conventional signage markings and moving them to the right. In fact, my contact at RTI had recently viewed a similar signage/marking system in Louisville, Ky.
While this may be a temporary setback, both the City and DOH had concerns, it isn't that the WVDOH acted unilaterally or is discouraging the overall idea of the bicycle routes.
Bill Robinson WVDOH
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Frank Gmeindl -
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